Date: 05 Aug 2000
Time: 02:58:00
This is some of the fulfillment of what Nathan shared with David in Chapter 12. David must be greatly saddened to see his family coming apart at the seams. He is grieving the death of one of his children, I think he recognises the consequences of his mistakes in the past. David had been so concerned about his career and his success, that I believe he neglected his family relationships: his wives, his children. I plan to emphasize this common mistaken priority in so much of contemporary society, and to exhort concerning the absolute necessity of family life being primary in what we are doing as Christian people. Pastor John in NH
Date: 07 Aug 2000
Time: 03:58:32
This has always been a very poignant passage for me. If nothing else, it speaks deeply to those parents who have known the heartbreak of having a son or daughter who rebelled against them and yet desperately loved them. It seems to me that the question that the passage raises is: what do you do with Absalom. On the one hand, there is the parental love that pleads, "deal gently with him." On the other hand, there are David's political advisors who know that the king (candidate, etc.) must be strong and deal harshly with those who threaten society/stability. This is where the ideal of loving one's enemies meets the "reality" of the world. I don't know all the answers, but I do know there is not enough gentleness in this world and there is far too much "toughness." What do we do with the Absaloms of today?
CSS
Date: 07 Aug 2000
Time: 14:36:58
This is a problem I hear a LOT! Parents whose children have left church in their teens and twenties, who have veered from the path their parents wished for them. I hear the story from laity and clergy alike. "What did we do wrong? What can we do now?" There is real pain here. I sure wish I could find some good hope filled and helpful answers. I'd put them in a sermon I know would mean something to folks in my pews and in my house. Got any ideas? Desperately, tom in TN(USA)
Date: 07 Aug 2000
Time: 15:32:48
Dear DPSers
I will be looking at the character of Joab. Who was he and what role did he play in the story of David. His loyalty, his disloyalty, and his outlook. I will be looking at his faith, or lack of faith. Where do I see this Archetype in my life? What message do I glean from this study. I have entitled my sermon "Jab" which is a takeoff on the name Joab.
Shalom
Pasthersyl
Date: 07 Aug 2000
Time: 20:44:17
Absalom and Jerusalem... the words of David and the words of Jesus seem to echo here over and over again. Perhaps David was not the father he should have been but can any of us make the decisions for our children when they become of age. The children stand on their own free will and even though David loved his son dearly he could not make choices for him. Power is a tool used by the evil one to destroy nations, states, churhes, and families... we must all be aware of the evil force of power... and God's authority to remove it so that God's plan will go forward. LPinPA
Date: 09 Aug 2000
Time: 16:38:50
In listening to your contributions, I want to ask these questions of the text, "Who are our Absoloms?, and I wonder if we choose to claim our relationship, kinship, and love for them (our Absaloms) before it is too late? Perhaps David should not have sent the order to deal gently, instead, in radically imatating God to Love our enemies, he perhaps should have followed God's order. Often in our relationships with people it is easier to give orders, and create orders or borders, than it is to love with the agape love that St. Paul describes in the Ephesians passage. -cs
Date: 10 Aug 2000
Time: 14:50:38
What is the lesson of this story? Too work out conflicts before they get to this point? To observe how far we fall in the midst of conflict? To demonstrate the futility of war? In Judaism they pause today for Tisha B'Av, a time to remember the tragedies that have befallen them. Perhaps this is what this story asks us to do? Remember this tragedy of David with the hope of not repeating it. Jeff,WNY
Date: 11 Aug 2000
Time: 03:49:20
The story about Absalom and parental grief is rampant in our society. Personally my Absalom is also a very angry man. He was in and out of treatment centers for acting out behavior; ran away; convinced my family that I was abusive; refused to take our support when he came out; is now HIV positive; can't keep a joy; and now he has fathered a child, and may go to Canada so that he doesn't have to pay for it. It's not always Absalom's parents fault. In many cases parents do everything in their power to help a child, but for whatever reason nothing works.
What to tell parents? Children make decisions that often don't fit with what we taught them. There are many more influences on our children today than in any other time in history. Children have seen so much of the underside of life, that it's rubbing off on even middle class families. Absalom makes poor mistakes, those mistakes have a consequence. Loving your child is no assurance that they will accept what you have to offer them emotionally or spiritually. The community of faith has a responsibility to help raise children - isn't that what baptism is all about? (Presby) Parents have a right and responsibility to have a life for themselves.
There is plenty of guilt to go around when it comes to dealing with Absalom. When we try our best and it still seems as if our effort has failed, forgive yourself. Pray for Absalom, but have a life separate from him. Sometimes we just need to detach. We are not called to die for Absalom, we are only called to love him, and sometimes love is not enough.
How do we deal with Absalom? Turn him over to God, and let go. Know that in the end it is really only Absalom's relationship to God that matters, and we can't do that for him.
My son, my son, you are in God's hands. mcp
Date: 11 Aug 2000
Time: 23:13:27
I'm torn. On one level, I resonate with the idea that there are so many "Absalom's" out there. Children of parishoners that are rebellious, struggle with alcohol or drugs, etc.
On another level, perhaps it is stretching the metaphor, but could we not also be the rebellious one's? Is there not some difficulty in placing the onus on "them" as the troubled teens. Where is our culpability?
I am also toying with the notion of grief and the New Testament reading this week on the Bread of Life. Title: matters of life and death I want to treat the honest and most heartfelt grief here with integrity, at the same time, I want to witness to the power of Jesus claim of new life. It's shaping up to be a good funeral sermon - yes, grief and pain, and yes new life and hope.
K in WA
Date: 12 Aug 2000
Time: 03:11:11
K in WA
I think you are on to something with your reflection on Davids (hence the parents of the Absaloms). What is our responsibility. Are we in anyway keeping our children from the church( thier possible spiritual home) by our attitudes? Do we have too much of a negative attitude toward their generation? Also your theme connecting this passage with the "Bread of life," is intriguing.
God bless all of us in our preaching
Shalom
Pasthersyl